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Okay, we're on Lesson 16, right? I sent out 17 this morning. You get it? And there are 17's back there that are printed. And we're dealing with sins and conscience. I think it's been a really cool subject for us to spend time in. Because I don't think we realize for quite some time in our Christian life what an influence our conscience has on our value system and our behavior.
So the first question is, what does the author say regards being able to rest as to sins committed? The question clear? Can a believer rest in the fact that he's committed sins? When you sin, do you rest about that? Yes, because if I confess, I'm just taken care of and I can rest. Can everybody hear him? So, one more principle I'd stick in there, but I think you're absolutely right. Christ's work on the cross allows us to have a conscience that's at peace and rest about indwelling sin. We all recognize that we have indwelling sin, right? Sin nature?
I haven't met anybody, you know, I know I've told this story a hundred times, but I like it, so I'll tell it again. When my son John was born, Donna was convinced he didn't have a sin nature. Guess what he did? He proved her wrong. So we all have this sin nature, we have the presence of sin in us, but we recognize that the sins that we commit are not on us. Can you make a distinction there? Wait, no. Sin is not on us. On us. That's probably the best way to put it. How do I say this? You say it's in instead of on. The sin principle is in us. Right. But when we sin, is the sin on us? In the sense that it's attached to us?
What do you think? I think it's as far away as the east is from the west. Okay, let's say that I sin, and then I get hit by a truck, and I didn't have a chance to confess. Am I going to purgatory? Probably. For a little while. A couple of things. How do I know from scripture, what has God done about the penalty for all the sins of the world? It's paid for. So I don't have to pay for them. So when I commit a sin as a believer, what's the consequence that I pay? Lack of fellowship with the Lord, right?
But from a positional standpoint, it doesn't bother, darken my position whatsoever. So the big reason that you can as a believer be at rest about your sins is the position that you enjoy, which is in Christ. A minute ago we were talking about Catholicism. One of the things that Catholicism teaches is that if you sin, you lose your position. We never do. So I recognize as a believer the position I have in Christ the fact that he has totally paid the penalty for all of my sins personally and the sins of the world, and I recognize the fact that I can confess them.
And what does the word confess mean? Agree with. So when I go to confess to the Lord about my sins, how do I agree with him? What am I going to say that's agreeing with him? I can't say to him I'm a dirty, rotten sinner, because I'm not, from a positional standpoint, am I? I can't say that. I can't get down on my knees and say, Oh God, forgive me, forgive me. Why not? Because he already has. So what do I say to him if I'm to say the same thing as he says? What am I supposed to say to him? I'm a new creature in Christ and I've been separated from my sin nature. I did sin but I don't have to. I agree with you that I'm a new creature and that was wrong for me. You're tracking pretty good. Everybody understand what I'm asking?
What do you actually say to God when you confess? If you're going to say the same thing that God says about you, what are you going to say? And oh, by the way, if you have 35 of them to confess, you have to wait until you get them all in? Well, Wanda, you're down to 26. I'm working on it. Think about it. If committing sins causes us to lose fellowship with the Lord Jesus, and then we have this provision in 1 John to confess, and he's faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. What do I do? What do I confess? How do I confess? What do I say? I'm not acting like who you tell me I am in Christ. I'm not acting as As you told me, I am in Christ. Yeah. Everybody hear that? No. As my position in Christ is, I'm in Christ. When I sin, I'm functioning inconsistent with who I am in Christ. I recognize it didn't affect my position, but it certainly did affect my condition because I was operating out of the flesh. What's God's relationship with the flesh? He doesn't have one anymore.
So notice that 1 John 1.9 doesn't say that we should ask God for forgiveness. Why not? Because we already are forgiven. We already recognize that.
That's my question. Now, no, it's important, I think, that you have the right concept about what confession really is. Like, Wanda and I grew up in a Catholic church, so every Saturday... I was a Baptist and then I went to Catholic. Oh, you're doubly bad. But every Saturday afternoon, We'd all march off to the church and we'd go to confession.
You'd go in that little box and you'd kneel down and this door would slide open and you'd confess your sins. And then it was up to the guy in the middle whether you were forgiven or not. If he recognized your voice and you'd been there a lot and you're confessing the same sins, sometimes he wouldn't give you what they call absolution. So you know what I used to do?
I'd walk out of that box and go in the next one. I'll find somebody I don't know. I'll find somebody who didn't know me. That became harder and harder. Yeah, as I got older. I was really excited when I came to college because nobody knew me here. I used to walk around the campus at Regis, and if a priest came by, the first thing I would say to him is, Bless me, Father, for I have sinned. And that starts the confession process. And they'd look at me and say, Doyle, not another word. Or I'd walk into the dorm at night and you have to check in and the priest is sitting there and I'd start that thing and he'd say, go to bed.
I think it's important that we have the idea or the concept about what confession is. It's fine as the Spirit of God convicts you. to talk about the specificity of what you think is the problem. But there's always have you not confessed and then thought 15 seconds later, oh, I forgot one. What if you did forget one? That's right. He's cleansed you from all unrighteousness. All of it. I've found that if I have five or six things, I get through two and I'm done. I know I'm restored. And see, here's the thing.
Because of our position in Christ, God does not want us to spend any more time in the flesh than necessary. So He doesn't want us to go through this remorseful, feel sorry program. None of that. He wants us restored instantly. And that's what confession does. To say the same thing as He says, and to put it as simply as I can, is to go to Him and say, I've just functioned, operated, committed sin that's inconsistent with who you say I am. I agree with you. Your son paid the price for my sins. I'm positioned in him and that's what I'm resting my faith on. And then I thank him. Anybody else want to add to that? Is that okay? Are you comfortable with that or is that kind of too easy? I don't think it's too easy because it's grace.
Now what's that saying that the sins are forgiven but not the consequences? Consequences are forgiven. Are they? When Christ paid the penalty for your sins, Wanda, he took care of not only the penalty but also the guilt. You may have to pay a consequence. I mean, if you pull out your 9mm and shoot your neighbor in the head, there's going to be a consequence. She's talking about the sin nature of the sins of wickedness. Yeah, and so the sin nature, is that what you're talking about?
Yeah. So I've noticed, I think my buddy across the street here is moving. I saw a for sale sign in this house. Oh no. I know. I hope a Christian doesn't buy the house. Yeah, what do you say? So here's the thing, from a positional standpoint, this is a class on position.
When you believe in the person and work of Christ, you went through the process, the mechanics of being identified with the Lord Jesus in his death. Death means separation. His burial, his resurrection, and his seeding. What did you get separated from when he died and you died in him?
The sin nature of the old man. My old man was crucified with him. So, that's a fact and it's a position. If I have never placed my faith in the person and work of Christ, I'm still attached to that old man, right? My sins are forgiven, but what did God do with the old man? He condemned him.
So if I'm attached to him and I leave the planet, I'm going to go where that sin nature goes and I'm going to be condemned because it's condemned. But for a believer, when I'm separated from the sin nature, when I leave the planet, it doesn't go with me.
I go to be in Christ. I'm not identified with that sin nature anymore. And that idea or that principle is part of what confession is. You understand, I know who I am. I know where I am and I know who I'm seated in before you, and that's what I'm relying my faith on. And I agree with you, Father, that you did that, and I've been acting like you didn't.
Okay? Alright? Okay. Oh, brother, here it comes. First John 1 night. Yeah. Okay. I understand what you're saying. I totally understand. Okay. But tying that in with how that is worded in here doesn't make it sound like that. Okay. Explain. Well, it says if, and you can say whether that's... That's if. It's if. Yeah, that's if. Okay.
If we confess our sins, he, I'm assuming is God, is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, which I thought had already taken place in what you're saying. and to cleanse us from all righteousness which already is taking place prior to the sin happening. So your question is? This makes it sound like the forgiveness of the sins is based on the commandment. I think the answer to that is when you read 1 John in there, are those verses conditional or positional? They're conditional. So we're talking about my condition or my walking around everyday existence on the earth. It's not talking about my position. It's talking about my condition.
So if I confess them, that's why I ask the question, what if I don't confess them? Am I not forgiven? I am forgiven. Why am I forgiven? because of the position I have. But if I don't confess them, I'm not going to be restored to fellowship. You see that? If you put it in context, read some verses before that, I think you'll see it's conditional, and it has to do with what you do when you sin. It doesn't affect your position. Has God not taken care of the sin issue in every one of our lives? Well, I was thinking that as you grow in the Lord, sometimes you're convicted of a sin that you didn't know was a sin.
That's true. At some point you realize, oh my goodness, this has been consistent with who I am in Christ also. That's right. So you can't ask for forgiveness to be restored. If it hasn't been made aware to you, right? Here's another question. When Christ died on the cross, were all of my sins future at that point? Were they taken care of then? So there can't be any left over. In other words, God can't say, Mike, I forgot to include that one in Christ.
I've used that on people who call me up who have a seared conscience about their behavior, and I'll say to them, oh that's right, God didn't take care of your sin on the cross, so you've got to really be worried. The confession is active, and the forgiven, the cleansed are an heiress. So the confessing is present, and the Forgiveness and a cleansing is in the aorist or past, past completed.
Or fact. Is that okay? That helps? Okay. Thank you. Any more questions about... Yeah, Joe? Is 1 John, say 5 maybe through 10, when we first believe? I think it's 1 John 1.9. Is that what you... in that context? Not really.
I think it's something that goes on in our whole Christian experience. Now I do think, along the lines of what Don is talking about, I do think early on, as a believer, we are much more conscious of sins and doing whatever we can to stay right with God. But as we grow spiritually and we We become more intimate with Christ. And you know when you're intimate with somebody, you kind of know what their likes and dislikes are.
So as we walk with the Lord, we don't go places because we know that's not of Him. See what I'm saying? We don't have to wait till we fell or we fall. We just know, I'm not going there because that's not of the Lord. And I'm not even thinking about whether it's sin or not, it's just not of Him. It's like my relationship with Donna. There are certain things, I'm not going there. I'm not struggling, but I'm not going to say or do, because I know it wouldn't please her. And I'm not interested in doing something that doesn't please her. But that wouldn't be true if I didn't know her so well.
Well, as we get to know the Lord Jesus more intimately, that same thing is true of us. And we get much more sensitive about this intimacy with Christ. Much more sensitive about that. So that you kind of know. You don't have to look it up, oh you think that was a sin or not? If it's not of Christ, I'm not going there. So there are two factors that come into play when we commit sin. If you've read the chapter, you'll know what I'm talking about.
What are they? He talked about Christ's advocacy and our confession. And the advocacy is the foundation of our confession. Everybody understand what an advocate is? When's the last time you hired a lawyer? He's an advocate on your behalf. So the Holy Spirit has been given to us and Christ is seated in the heavenly.
Let's look at Ephesians 2.6 just to get the position down.
What does Ephesians 2.6 tell us? Somebody read it. So who did that? God did it. He himself, after Christ had condemned sin in the flesh, he raised us up and he seeded us with him in heavenly places in Christ Jesus. That is a permanent fact. Everybody understand that? That is a permanent fact. You can be the greatest sinner after yourself saved and you can never discount or disown that fact. What does it mean for Christ to be our advocate?
Did I give you Hebrews 9.24? Take a look at that. You don't get to read, somebody else has to.
Hebrews 9.24. Christ did not enter a holy place made with hands. a mere copy of the true one, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us.
So when Hebrews 9.24 says Christ did not enter the holy place made with hands, where's that?
Where was that place? That's where we live. No. Our places were made with hands. No. What is it? It's the old Jewish temple. Okay. It says that Christ didn't go there. after he died and rose from the dead, but where did he go? And he says that the Hebrew temple, the Holy of Holies, was just a mere copy of the true one. So there is a place that's the true place where God himself sits and exists. But he went into the heavenlies himself, now to appear in the presence of God for us. So is he up there having this shouting match with Satan about our sins? An advocate is one who speaks on behalf of another. So if I needed an attorney for some problem that I couldn't or didn't have the knowledge or expertise or skill to take care of it, I would hire somebody. an advocate who would go and plead my case.
And it can be criminal or it can be civil, it can be... I've been before the Denver Board of Realtors, not the Denver Board, but the Colorado Real Estate Commission a couple of times. And you never go there without an attorney, without an advocate. Because their job is to try to bury you, whether you're right or not. And so you always want an advocate. always do.
And so the Lord Jesus is our advocate who supports us. Where is he supporting us? In the very presence of God. He now is to appear in the presence of God for us. He's not only our advocate, but he's also a high priest. What does that mean? What does a priest do? What's his job? Who does a priest represent? He represents the people before God. What does a prophet do? He represents God before the people. A priest represents the people before God. So not only is he our advocate, but he's also our high priest. And so he, as our high priest, he's there on our behalf in order to effectuate what he has accomplished. Not what you have accomplished, but he has included you.
So how do you think this goes? Let's say JD, you know, once a week he probably sins, right? Maybe twice. And so, well, I've just looked at him probably three times. He appeals to his advocate. He confesses. So what happens between the Father and the Son? What happens? What goes on there? Because there is this guy called the Accuser of the Brethren, who is our pal Satan, who is saying, this J.D. guy, how can you count him righteous?
Look what he did. What does the Lord Jesus do? Actually he doesn't do anything. He doesn't even do that. You know why? Because he didn't get in there until all the work was done. So he just sits there. He doesn't have to stand up and defend JD. It's all over with.
When King killed Abel, God said his blood is crying out to me. And in the same way, the blood sacrifice of Christ is the vocalization of God, the advocacy if you will, that is continually speaking about the perfection of that work. Boy, if I stand here I can smell the popcorn, can you? Somebody's cooking popcorn. I'm going to talk about atonement here in a minute and propitiation along those lines. I was trying to think of the word advocacy, being a spokesman for us. But Christ's blood is continually speaking for us. Well, not only is His blood speaking for us, but His very presence, because we're united to Him. So God sees His Son, He's satisfied. That's right.
And I don't know how all of these parts work in eternity, because I'm stuck in time. To me, you know, everything's sequential to me. But not with God. Everything is now. And the now of the presence of the Lord Jesus in the presence of the Father is a completed thing. It's not, he's got, well give me five minutes to plead my case. It's not that. It's over with. The Lord Jesus is our advocate. That's true. That's exactly right.
And an advocate, does an advocate not necessarily have to use words? In our case, it kind of does. But in the heavenly, does he have to use words? I don't think he does, because he's there and we're united to him and we're seated positionally in him. He just sits there. Well, and he couldn't be there without him having completed the work. That's exactly right.
After what you said, a question came up, thinking about this. What if you miss one of the sins? Or what if you just don't confess it? What happens? I don't know, I might go to purgatory. That's what Juana said. Now what happens to my position or to my condition? Or both? Both.
So I take out my 9mm and I shoot Roy in the forehead. And you run and call 911 and here they come and they arrest me. And I say to them, you can't touch me. I'm seated in Christ in the heavenlies. I shot Roy in the head, but I'm forgiven. They're going to say, come with me please. Put your hands behind your back. And they're going to prosecute me and say I never confessed that sin. Did it affect my position? Did it affect my condition?
Oh man, not only did I lose fellowship with the Lord Jesus, look what these people are doing to me. Not even a nightmare where there's even consequences. The stupid little sin of, you know, an angry or whatever that's not going to get arrested or whatever. Yeah, but they were one of those real deadly ones.
Yeah, but I guess the thought when you said that he's there all the time spurred me that I don't, I mean, this is a way to restore fellowship to me. But he's our advocate whether we come to him or not. That's true. It doesn't matter whether we come. That's to restore our fellowship. But he's always there as our advocate. Whether we come or not, or the accuser is accusing us, he's our advocate. We don't need to plead our case to have him be an advocate, regardless. I'm probably going to jump ahead, but this would be a good time. How many advocates do we have? Two. Who are they?
Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit. And what does the Holy Spirit do? His advocacy is not in the heavenlies. His advocacy is in me. So what is he doing? Convicts you. He's a convictor. He shows you what you've done and what the consequences are. So we really have two advocates. We've got one here and one there. That's a pretty good deal. You get two lawyers for the price of one. He'll guide your prayer of confession, too. Sure. Sure he will.
So I think that's probably to recognize that the Spirit of God You know, if I'm stubborn or I'm insisting on living in the flesh, the spirit, you know, it's like the Nazi guy says, we have ways of dealing with that, you know. But the spirit has ways of dealing with my stubbornness, my walking in the flesh, my refusal to confess or whatever he would call me to do. Just a thought here.
I wrestled with this. how this all works out with 1 John 1.9.
This whole 1 John 1.9 confession thing is a family issue.
And when you're thinking about condemnation from sin, you're talking about position and you're talking about relationship issues that are at the higher positional level. You're not talking about the conditional family. relationships and the experiential level, right? So, it's not a mechanical process that we go through in terms of confession. It's not something that we put a reminder on our phone to, I gotta check and see if there's any sins that I need to confess today, so that I can make sure that things are going to be okay.
When you have a relationship with the Lord, you have fellowship with Him, and that fellowship causes you to be thinking in light of the knowledge of the Word of God that you have. and you're walking with the father, and as sin interferes with that, and the flesh is trusted over and against the new man, you have a problem. And it's just like a son with his dad, he took that knife, and he wasn't supposed to take the knife to school with him. you bear a weight and that weight causes a reaction to deal with the problem and that biblical solution is confession and what that affords us is a cleansing not a removal of condemnation because that was already taken care of but now once you confess you make things right with your father and you are cleansed from the guilt of walking in the flesh in that way and that's a conditional familial issue that only believers know and can understand from that first John 1 passage. So, I guess I just wanted to add that whole family dynamic there because this isn't, and if you miss one, if you're walking with the Lord and you didn't know of a sin that needed to be committed, that's not an issue. In terms of a penalty or cleansing or anything like that, if you're in that conscious that Holy Spirit Consciousness brings to light something, it's on you to deal with it.
Just like a son would with a father, it's a family thing. And that getting right is an opportunity to to be who you are initially. And I think from a family standpoint, all members of the family have the same advantages. Every one of them has the Spirit of God dwelling in him or her. And every one of us have an advocate with the Father in a family.
So if I'm cruising along, like Donna mentioned before, there are sins If you come to the Lord as an adult like I did, there were over some years, there were things that became sins that I never knew were sins. But I was convicted about them. Primarily because, well, that's not of the Lord. Why would you go there? I never was bothered by it. Then I got bothered by it because the Spirit was doing His job. And I didn't need to confess that over and over again until it sort of got put in its place.
It's just a recognition that what is going to come down to is the family intimacy with the Lord Jesus. Because within a family, within our house, John was here last weekend, we don't go around thinking, I don't want to do anything to offend John. We just live. And we just abide. And we just walk in Christ. And if we step over the bounds, that's what the Spirit is there to do. Not only show you, but to restore you. So we can trust Him to do His job. And it's really important that we trust him to do what he's been sent to do, and he's really good at it. One last thought, without, we didn't have this position-condition differentiation as a church.
1 John 1-9 becomes a law that causes anxiety, worry, constant analysis of oneself, the focus is always on you and where you stand. Maybe it's not to the degree of losing salvation, but it's darn close and you're constantly teetering on that. Is it or isn't it? Yeah. If we're sitting here thinking, why are we going over this all the time in this church? It's because if you don't, you're going to be stuck under law of some kind in terms of this relationship. Yeah.
It has massive impact on the way we live our lives, how our kids grow up understanding how this works. It's such a crucial, especially when they start in the teenage years and issues become issues that weren't before. They were just kids playing before. Now all of a sudden there are things going on inside that they're troubled about. You don't ever want them to lose their family intimacy. You always want your kids to come to you no matter what it is, and you may have to go to them.
I used to tell John sometimes, I want you to go in the living room and sit down and wait for me. Recognizing that the wait was going to be really tough on him, because I was coming at some point. And usually it was so that I could calm down, right? And that I could deal with him in a manner that was loving, which I didn't always do. You know, talk about committing sins and wanting... I'd have killed him four or five times if I wasn't a Christian.
But I recognize how, especially with children, as your parents, There's nobody in the world that can grate on you like your kids can. When you expect more of them and then they, oh my goodness, they're human beings with sin natures. And they did something that, well it's cool when a son or a daughter realizes this principle. It makes it a lot easier for them to understand and for you to understand and really what's going on. Why do you sit down with your kids when they sin? You want to restore them, you don't want to beat them up.
Mike, that's, I think, kind of going to your point, the family, but the two advocates we have, and that's kind of what I was pointing out, we have an advocate in heaven who's paid and sitting down, and the accuser can do all he wants, and our position is not impacted.
The Holy Spirit's job, two things, convince and convict. convince us of who we are, give us the knowledge of who we are, and to convict us when we're sinning. And that's the conditional part of it. The two advocacies are different in that one is almost more conditional and family-oriented. Our time here and how we react and how we do and how we live, that's the Holy Spirit's job.
But what brought me to it is when you're saying that Christ is just sitting there. The accuser can come all day long whether we confess or not or do anything. It's positional. And it doesn't matter whether we can confess or do anything. That's the Holy Spirit's job is to convince us that we sin and confess. But the powerful position that we have, it doesn't matter whether we come or not or whatever. Our position is never to change. And nervousness is always there. The accuser can do it all day long whether we confess or not. Conditionally, a family relationship is the Holy Spirit that can convince and convict us.
What about that young man I was watching in the Olympics that caused all this problem? And he was talking and he said, not only Have I disappointed and disgraced my family? I've disgraced our country. I've disgraced the whole world. And I think, oh, I mean, I don't know that I really felt sorry for him, but I thought, I mean, it's bad enough when you sin and it just hurts one person or someone and you can go, what? He needs to know. He needs the Lord. The cool thing about that or the interesting thing about that is he hired a consultant to tell him what to say. I didn't always think that it was coming really from...
Well, I mean, what happened there? Some swimmers, after their events were over, went out and got loaded. And they couldn't find a place to go to the bathroom, so they broke down the door in a gas station, and broke the place up and came out, and they were yelling at the guys that owned the gas station, saying, well, you've got to pay for it, and they're giving them grief, and off they went. They were drunk. So, I've never done anything like that. Not that I'm not at that level. The whole world's watching and they got it on video tape. Oh man. I was going to say. I lost my train of thought. That's okay. I'm sorry. That's okay.
The Lord Jesus is in the Father's presence to demonstrate two principles that are in play here. One is what we call propitiation, and the other one is called atonement. So when we sin in word, deed, word, thought, or deed, consciously or unconsciously, we've already spoken about this, what does our advocate do? He's seated in the Father's presence, Does there need to be communication?
I don't think so, although there probably is. He's faithful to intercede for us and it's founded upon his perfect work and thereby our right of position in our Father's presence is forever maintained. Understand what I just said? Because of Him, our right for our position is ever maintained. And although our sins are never imputed to us, they do defile us and hinder our fellowship with the Father.
So the next question I have, and we'll talk about propitiation and atonement. I've run out of time, but we'll do that next week. Why is he seated? Hebrews 10.12 says, but this man after he had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right hand of God. Why is he seated? The work is done.
There is nothing for him to do. As far as our position is, our acceptance before the Father, there is nothing that he has to do. So his His advocacy is not to try to maintain our position. Some Christians are so arrogant they think that their sins causes the Lord to stand up again and argue on their behalf. He's not getting up. He doesn't have to because by his blood he entered once into the holy place having attained eternal redemption for us.
It's over and I wish from a conscious standpoint more believers understood the totality of the work of Christ before the Father. And it really is kind of a slap in the face of the Lord Jesus when you don't rest in what He's already done. That we think there's something else that I have to do or I've got to clean up my act in the process or something before God will accept me.
And if you live under a lost system, that's what the lost system is really all about. That your sins and your obedience and your lifestyle has got to match up with who Christ is. And if you're not cutting it, you better feel guilty about it. Your conscience better sear you.
Let me ask you a question. As a grown spiritual believer, do you really need to rely on your conscience so much? What do you think? Add another question to it. Is that two? If I have the Holy Spirit indwelling me and He's doing what the Word of God says He's doing, do I need to rely on my conscience?
I can rely on Him. I can rely on Him. But what He does is He gets the conscience lined up. But my reliance, and that's one of the processes I think that the Spirit of God goes through in a growing believer, is to get them to begin to rely on Him for what He's been sent to do, rather than their conscience.
Because your conscience can convict you about something that sometimes you have to just reject what it's saying to you. Wait a minute, that's not right. Question 7 next week. This may not be difficult, but when I was trying to envision over in the conversation that Satan and Jesus had, whether he uses words or not, I mean, it's almost that simple. Yeah, it really is. Alright, let's close.
Dear Father, how we thank you. We thank you so much for our position and that we may continue to grow in the knowledge of your Son, the Lord Jesus, and our position that's included in Him. And we thank you for sure for the grace that we continue to live under. In your Son's name, Amen.