Q&A 19: What about babies who die? Q&A 20: Will we recognize each other?
Vern Peterman · May 30, 2010
Questions & Answers, No. 22
Holly Hills Bible Church
https://hollyhillsbiblechurch.org/teaching/messages/492624385437

Transcribed from the recording by SermonAudio, so expect the occasional misheard word.

The handout here has two questions on one handout, so that's kind of changing the pace from the usual. First question, what happens to baby souls, including the unborn, if they die? Why, by the way, why is that a particularly relevant and important question?

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, what's what's happened to my baby? You know what has happened to the soul of this baby? How is this going to turn out? eternally so yeah a very important question and You know we have ladies in this in this very church body who have been through one or more miscarriages and And so the answer to that question is not only a relevant one, but intensely personally valuable to have an answer. To be able to lay things, you know, painful, yeah, no question about it. But to be able to lay things at rest in terms of what's the eternal outcome here with this baby. that was taken home before even being born.

So yeah, that's an important one. We also have, in the midst of that, we have what's been termed, and I don't think inappropriately, a holocaust in our own country with the Roe versus Wade decision. Big, big issue out there. Millions and millions since that decision. Tens of millions, actually, of infants killed for the sake of abortion. And so that again, it raises the same question.

And how do we settle that in our hearts? Not that abortion is ever the right thing to do, but the outcome and what's the spiritual outcome there for that baby can be a troubling question for people. What are some other reasons why it could be a very important question? Yeah? Well, you have all the answers. That's great. Oh. I'm joking. Go ahead. If I pull your leg, don't worry about it. One won't end up being longer than the other.

Yeah. I would just think of the gals who have had abortions. Yeah. Very important question. Yeah. For a gal who has an abortion and later on comes to recognize that was not a good thing to do. But then what happened to this baby? that I had killed. Here's another one. Dr. Bernard Nathanson. I don't know if he's even still alive.

He was, at one point in time, a leader in the abortion movement, both in terms of leading the industry, if you will, and in the political action and even the court decision. A pivotal fellow. He since became a Christian and he said he was personally responsible either by his direct action or by supervision for 60,000 abortions. And after having become a Christian and realizing that that was wrong, someone asked him, how do you deal with the heaviness of that on your heart? And with the recognition that you were responsible either by your direct action or by supervision for 60,000 abortions, he says, there is only one way to handle that weight of guilt. And he says, and that is to entrust your sins to Jesus Christ. He says, there is no other way. How else could you, with full recognition of it, handle that at heart? So, yeah, your point is well taken.

There's abortions. We're not done. What else might be the case? Yeah? Yeah. With which? Yes, the frozen embryos and things of that sort where you run into those kinds of questions. Yeah. be directly getting into this, but there's another issue. There's another one I'm looking at, and those, let's say an infant dies after, you know, being born, and, you know, here the parents and family all get their heart, you know, kind of wrapped around this little kid, and then something happens, whether it's an accident, an illness, and the baby dies. What happened? How do I make something good of this?

Yes, yeah. So at any rate, let's take a look here at this. I think the thing is we have several different areas in which this is a very relevant question and one that needs to be answered so that people can lay things kind of at rest at their heart here.

First of all, we have to recognize that the Bible is a revelation to those who are living and who must believe in Christ for salvation and grow in God's revealed truth. So it's directed at those who can hear and read and understand. That's what the Bible is written for.

It's not directed at those who, like the unborn child, obviously they can't understand it. We don't have lots of material in the Bible that directly addresses this question. I'm not saying there isn't any. There is some, and we'll be looking at it. But I think also to recognize the Bible is written primarily for and directed to those who will hear and listen and believe and grow from God's Word. So that's the primary thing. Nonetheless, there are some points of real comfort for those who have lost a child before birth or at a young age.

Christ paid the debt for the sins of the whole world, and physical age isn't a distinction. As you made the point, Doris, sin is something that has been characteristic of man from the point of conception, from the time that Adam sent. 1 John 2, I have 1D and 2, Jesus Christ the righteous and he himself is the propitiation that is the satisfaction of God's holiness for our sins and not for ours only but also for those of the whole world and By the way, I don't take this as the Calvinist do only for the whole world of the elect Okay but for the whole world as a matter of fact, by the way, John Calvin's will John Calvin's will said that Jesus died for the sins of the human race. Anyway, I'm not sure John Calvin was a Calvinist.

Anyway, let's go. God is infinitely merciful by character and takes the initiative in providing salvation. Psalm 145, 8 and 9, the Lord is Gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and great in lovingkindness. The Lord is good to all, and His mercies are over all His works."

1 John 4.10, and also I have a couple other passages referenced here.

Romans 5.6 and Galatians 4.4 and 5.

In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation. Here is the satisfaction of God's holiness for our sins. Even the unborn child is a matter of God's infinite knowledge and awareness. It is not as though God doesn't care about that unborn child. He does. And here is one assurance of that. Psalm 139 verses 13 through 16.

For you formed my inward parts, you wove me in my mother's womb. I will give thanks to you for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works, and my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in secret and skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth. The depths of the earth being a figure of speech, but out of sight, basically, is what that's talking about. Your eyes have seen my unformed substance, and in your book were all written the days that were ordained for me when as yet there was not one of them.

Does God care? Does God see? Does God know about that infant who was just developing? Quite so. I think that passage says it very clearly. God does indeed care about that infant though unborn. The next thing we have here, there is a strong implication that infants who do not have the opportunity to believe are taken to be with the Lord, where saved adults will go as well. 2 Samuel 12, 22-23 gives the account of David, Bathsheba, and the baby that they had together. While the child was still alive, I fasted and wept. For I said, who knows, the Lord may be gracious to me that the child may live. But now he has died, why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I will go to him, but he will not return to me." Interesting. I think the implication there is David will go to be one day with this child. But David won't have that child come back to live here. I think that's what David is saying. Aside from that, I think we have other things to look to.

Let's look at page 2, the very top. Here's Matthew 18. That's a very full chapter, by the way, but we'll be looking at verses 1 and 2 and then verse 14. At that time, the disciples came to Jesus and said, who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven? In the kingdom of heaven, of course, we're looking at the future millennial kingdom. And he called a child to himself and set him before him.

And then later on in that passage in verse 14, so it is not the will of your father who is in heaven that one of these little ones perish. Interesting. It's not the will of your father that one of these little ones perish. In Matthew 18.14 the Greek word for perish is the same word translated perish in John 3.16 which has to do with salvation. For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whoever believes in him shall not perish. but have eternal life. That word for perish is perish eternally. Perish is to be in hell.

Here's John 10, 28. Jesus says of his sheep, they shall not ever, it's not even remotely possible, that they would perish of their own doing, that they would go to hell of their own doing. Here's Matthew 19, the very next chapter, verses 13 through 15. Then some children were brought to him so that he might lay hands on them and pray. And the disciples rebuked them. But Jesus said, let the children alone. And by the way, who does it sound like the disciples were rebuking? The children.

Yeah. It sounds, I mean, let the children come. let the children alone and do not hinder them from coming to me for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these after laying his hands on them he departed from there now those are I think the scripture passages that address the question most directly I think what we look at is God does care and is quite aware of the life that is still In the mother's womb, God does care about and is quite aware of these little children.

And we've got one other question here I didn't even attempt to answer, but let's do so even though it's not on the page. Ever heard of the age of accountability? I don't know what that age is. I think that's more of a made-up term, but I think it's like salvation.

Do you know everybody that's saved? and everybody that's going to be, and are you able to judge that? And does God ask you to? No. I'm glad I don't have to decide. God is the one who decides because he knows hearts. I really don't want to be in that place. But by the same token, I also don't know and I don't see the scripture gives me a material to decide if there's some magical age when a person becomes accountable to the Lord to believe.

I think very likely that that could differ from one person to the next. In my own case, I know I was four and a half and I insisted that I know the gospel at age four-and-a-half, and that was what was going to happen. I think others at age four-and-a-half may not be ready. And I have heard of instances of people becoming believers at even younger than I was. So the age of accountability, I think there is such a thing. I think God knows it, and it likely varies between each individual. Some have said, oh, it's age 12 or something of that sort, because that's sort of the the age of Bar Mitzvah, but I'm not sure that that is a measure.

Ultimately, it's like the issue of salvation itself. The Lord knows the heart and the mind and knows what people are capable of. I would share one other item here, and this is with a caveat. I've kind of blocked it off with a couple of lines in the middle of page two.

Scripture is always primary and not our experiences. I think that it is very important that believers learn to measure experience by scripture and not scripture by experience. We don't establish doctrine on the basis of experience. We let scripture do the establishing of doctrine and the interpreting of everything in life. That having been said, here is a quote from Dwight L. Moody. This is written by one of his sons. And it says in the middle of page two there, Dwight O. Moody, as he hovered between life and death, said this, Earth recedes. Heaven opens before me. If this is death, it is sweet. There are no valleys here. God is calling me. I must go. His son, who was standing by his bedside, said, No, no, father, you are dreaming. No. said Mr. Moody, I am not dreaming.

I have been within the gates. I have seen the children's faces. Now again, this is not scripture, so always use scripture first. People can say all sorts of things, but I think this is interesting what he said and how he put it. He could have just said, I've been to heaven and I know the Lord's there, or something like that. But instead, to put it this way, I have been within the gates, I have seen the children's faces.

Again, that's secondary, but I think it's an interesting piece of secondary evidence, if you'll call it that. Conclusion, while the Bible is focused toward those who are able to read and hear its message and who come to be saved by faith and to grow spiritually by believing what the Lord has revealed, it does offer some real comfort to those who have lost a baby, either before birth or after, or a little child. And I would suggest to you that these things that are on here, just a couple of pages, It would be valuable things to keep in mind if you come across someone who at any stage has obviously a personal tragedy. This is very painful, but nonetheless can be some important hope that they have. At any rate, I think it's an important piece. Here's what's interesting.

Scripture doesn't go into a great deal of detail about how this all works out. I found it very interesting that Scripture does not put a great deal of description into what heaven will be like. Do we have some? Yes, we do. For what it's worth, Revelation, one of my favorite books, has 150 verses that are on the heavenly scene. We do have some description there.

What's also interesting is Scripture does not go into great detail about describing hell. As a matter of fact, that is one of the marks of the fake Bible books, is they will go into great detail describing heaven and hell. Scripture itself does not. So exactly how this works out, I don't know.

However, as an unborn baby, that little infant obviously has very limited capability to communicate and continue on, it would seem to make sense from anything that scripture does describe that there would be a full ability to understand and communicate in the heavenly realms.

And matter of fact, what we will see next I think will go along with that. So a part of the answer is about to come here. But I think what we have is mostly implication, but I think the implication is you can't, it would be hard to imagine that the Lord is going to have this person spend eternity unable to communicate. And here's something else.

Remember where David says, I'll go to him, but he can't come to me or he won't come to me. David seemed to have an understanding that he was going to actually see this child and and the implication there is that there would be an identification of that's the child that You know was here on earth And and now I get to see him him specifically Not just isn't you know here's heaven's nursery and God bunch of eternal babies.

Yeah. You had your hand up. It seems like if you have a little teeny baby that's premature, and then you have the Christian sailor that dies in the sea, both their bodies have issues. But in heaven, it seems like a literal body. Yeah, yeah, ultimately you look at it, the Lord is providing the new body. It's miraculously provided.

And that new body has different abilities than this present one. Even as here's Christ, who, here's the disciples all gathered together and they don't need to open the door for him. That wasn't like the body he had here. The thing is that the Lord will give us a new body that has different capabilities, and I'm very glad for that, by the way, and some huge improvements over the present one.

Let's take a look at page three. This is the beginning of a three-page answer to the question, when we get to heaven, will we recognize the people we knew on earth? I think there are several indications to answer this question. Most assuredly, yes. The first one, Jesus speaking to Jews in a Jewish context, so that's important, nonetheless conveyed a principle of identification of persons after they are resurrected. Here's Matthew 8, 11, and 12.

I say to you that many will come from east and west and recline at table with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. Do they know who they are? Yeah, they certainly do. Isn't that something? Luke 16, 19-31 is a similar kind of passage. There is a clear identification in that passage of who Abraham is. The next one, Christ's resurrection. Christ is resurrected with a body like ours will be. That's 1 John 3, 1 and 2. And while there were times when he was not recognized, there were also times when he was recognized. Here is Luke 24.

This is the disciples on the road to Emmaus. And they approached the village of Emmaus where they were going, and he acted as though he were going further. But they urged him, saying, stay with us, for it is getting toward evening, and the day is now nearly over. So he went in to stay with them. In verse 30, and when he had reclined at the table, with them. He took the bread and blessed it, and breaking it, He began giving it to them. Then their eyes were opened, and they recognized Him, and He vanished from their sight." Why did He vanish? Why didn't He stick around?

I mean, you know, hey, now we know who this guy is! Heavens sakes! Now we can actually talk with Him! He goes, poof! I don't know if the bread that He was holding fell on the table or what. I hope it didn't roll off on the floor. That would be a shame. But anyway. Why did he vanish? Not yet. But well, if you say glorified as ascended, not yet. And he wasn't going to be ascending from right there. That was going to be later. So very interesting. Matter of fact, this is practically within 24 hours of his resurrection. He hadn't even been resurrected a whole day.

So why did he vanish? When did he vanish? At what point did he vanish? What had just happened? He told them what they needed to hear, but they didn't recognize him yet. When did he vanish? Just when they recognized him. That was the point. They said, that's Jesus. And I don't think they got the second S out. You know, it was the moment of recognition. They needed to recognize who he was. And that's when he vanished. They needed to recognize him. But the point is, did they recognize him? Yes, they came to a point of recognition.

John 20, 24 through 28 is a similar account of recognition, and you're certainly free to look that up. Here's another one. In order for us to be rewarded in heaven for things that were done on earth, We have several different passages that point to that from Romans 14 12 to Hebrews 13 17 There has to be a degree of connection and continuation between the two person by person In other words we don't show up in the heavens say Who am I you know? What am I doing here? You know?

There is a sense of that was me Similar to Before Paul became a believer, he was an unbeliever, right? And yet, when he became a believer years later, about three times in the book of Acts, it tells about Paul's account of when he was saved there on the road to Damascus. And when he describes it himself, He says, I, I, I. He was a recognizable person before and he continues to be afterwards even though a profound spiritual change has taken place, right?

So in order for us to have rewards that make some kind of sense, there has to be a recognition and a connection to the identity that we had here. Here's the next one, a new heaven and a new earth. God's word makes clear, and I'm on the bottom of page three here. God's word makes clear that what lies ahead for us is radically different from what we have experienced on this earth. Here's a pivotal passage about what is new. Here's Revelation, chapter 21, verses one through seven.

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and first earth passed away, and there was no longer any sea. And I saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God.

I won't be too loud here. Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and He will dwell among them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself will be among them, and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and there will be no longer any death. There will no longer be any mourning or crying or pain. The first things have passed away.

And he who sits on the throne said, Behold, I am making all things new. And he said, Write for these things. These words are faithful and true. Then he said to me, it is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give to the one who thirsts from the spring of the water of life without cost. He who overcomes will inherit these things and I will be his God and he will be my son.

Let's examine, we've got several bullets here, some of the things that are new. The new things are the new heaven and new earth. will not be just sequentially new, but will be new in kind. That Greek word is kainos. It's new in kind, not just new compared to what was sequentially older. The next thing is there is no longer any sea, but apparently still land.

Next, there will no longer be any death. A reversal of the introduction of death in Genesis chapter 3. That's where death was introduced because God said the day that you eat of it, you will die. Of course, it was not physical death immediately, but there was immediately separation from God. Next one, there will no longer be any mourning, crying or pain.

No longer. No longer. God's dwelling with redeemed human beings is central to the description in heaven, the New Jerusalem, and earth, and out joined rather than far apart. Right now we talk about heaven and it's somewhere out there, somewhere up there, right? No more. No more somewhere distant. Right here, right now, God dwelling among men.

So this helps us understand a number of things about the new heaven, new earth, but does not by itself help us answer a question about recognizing people when we get to heaven. In order to answer our question, though, let's look at some subsequent verses in these last two chapters in Revelation. There's Revelation 21, 10 through 14. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain and showed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God. having the glory of God.

Her brilliance was like a very costly stone, as a stone of crystal-clear jasper. It had a great and high wall with twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names were written on them, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel. There were three gates on the east, three gates on the north, three gates on the south, and three gates on the west. And the wall of the city had 12 foundation stones, and on them were the 12 names of the 12 apostles of the Lamb. So we can see this passage, there are identities beginning to show up, including Christ the Lamb. By the way, if Christ is the Lamb in the new heavens and new earth, how does that connect to the old, this present heavens and earth? How does that imply a recollection and an identification of things here on this earth? Okay, this earth right now is under a curse and what's going to be the means of changing that? What did it require? Yes, the new earth, but how would that happen? Who would be the one by whom that change would come about?

Christ. And Christ would die, and he would be the Lamb. John, by the way, is the one author in the New Testament who identifies Christ as the Lamb. Twice in the first chapter of the Gospel of John, and then from beginning to end in the book of Revelation. When we look at the new heavens and new earth, guess what we find? Christ is still the Lamb. He is still the Lamb who took the sins of the world upon Himself, even in the new heavens and new earth. The recognition that there was sin, the recognition that the sin had to be paid for, the recognition that Christ was indeed that Lamb, just as John the Baptist declared twice in the first chapter of the Gospel of John, There is still a recognition that He paid the price, even in the New Heavens, New Earth.

You see, you and I won't be having mourning and crying and pain and weeping, but there will be a recognition forever of the greatness of what Christ did. And there will still, we won't be seeing Well, I wonder who that is. It will still be a recognition. That is Christ. That's the One.

I won't be mourning. I won't be crying. I won't be in pain. I won't be in agony. I will not have regrets. But somehow I will still recognize that Christ, Christ the Lamb, paid a price I never could. And I will glorify Him forever because of it. I won't be crying about it. I won't be regretting it. I won't be thinking, oh, I shouldn't have, oh, I should have. None of that will come up. But there will still be a recognition of the unfathomable price that He paid and who He is as the one singular Lamb for all eternity, God's Lamb. That will still be there. We will still recognize Him. Additionally, we see the twelve tribes of Israel are identifiable by name. And by the way, death entered in Genesis, right? Death was resolved in Revelation. Twelve tribes, where do they show up? Where do you first see them? Genesis, right? Where do we see them the last time?

Here in Revelation. And they're in the new heavens and the new earth. The twelve tribes The tribes of Israel are still identifiable in the New Heavens, New Earth. Look at the top of page five. What you see is three tribes on each of the four sides out in the tabernacle, out in the desert. And what do you see described in the New Jerusalem? Three tribes each on four sides in the New Jerusalem at the gates.

Back in the tabernacle, if a Gentile, in the days of the tabernacle out in the desert, if a Gentile wanted to approach the Lord, guess who they went through? They went through the twelve tribes arranged just like this. In the new heavens and the new earth, If you want to get into the New Jerusalem, you know what you're going to do? You're going to go through three tribes on each of the four sides, just like the encampment out in the desert.

Israel is still identified and identifiable in the New Heavens and New Earth, even in the arrangement that matches what they had out in the desert 3,400 years ago. Further, the names of the Twelve Apostles are also identifiable as such, though they are last all named individually in Acts chapter 1. Nonetheless, we identify not only the Twelve Tribes of Israel, but the Apostles by name in the New Heavens and New Earth.

Revelation 21, 22 through 27, I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God, the Almighty, and the Lamb, here is again the recognition of the Lamb, the one who paid the price for us that we recognize for eternity. And the city has no end, excuse me, no need of the sun or the moon to shine on it for the glory of God is illuminated and its lamp is the lamb. The nations will walk by its light, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it. In the daytime, for there will be no night there, its gates will never be closed. And they will bring the glory and the honor of nations into it, and nothing unclean, and no one who practices abomination and lying shall ever come into it, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life."

So we see here also the nations, the Greek ethnos. These are the ethnic ones. We get our word ethnic or ethnicity from that. Those who were Gentiles while on the earth are identifiable as a people, just like the Jews are, just like the church is, the apostles of the Lamb, right?

Then we see in verse 27 that there's reference to the names of those who are in the Lamb's Book of Life, the role of living citizens. One of the indicator books in the New Testament is the book of Philippians. The book of Philippians is a book written to a Roman colony. Philippi was a Roman colony and anyone in any of those Roman colonies valued highly Roman citizenship. If you were a Roman soldier, you worked your entire time as a soldier that at the end you would get a pension of land and also Roman citizenship at the end of it. You had to work your whole life to be a citizen.

So what does Paul write in the first chapter of Philippians? He writes, It says there, conduct yourselves. The word is palata uamai, which means, that's where we get a similar root for politics or political, that kind of an idea. It means conduct yourselves as citizens.

Citizens of where? Citizens of heaven. Because that's exactly what it's going to say in chapter 3. You are citizens of heaven. Here they worked their whole life long to become a Roman citizen, And you get to be a citizen of heaven by just believing. And then in chapter 4, he talks about those who have their names written in the Book of Life. The Book of Life in those days was the list of living citizens.

So there's repeated reference to this citizenship. Three of the four chapters of Philippians make reference to that citizenship. It only shows up clearly in our English translations there in chapter 3. But three of the four chapters have reference to citizenship. Citizenship is important, and it's mentioned here.

The names in the Lamb's Book of Life are because you're a citizen. If you're a believer now, you already have your citizenship. That's where you got your citizenship. Your name is in the Lamb's Book of Life because you're a living citizen. And when you leave this earth, even if you die physically, you're a citizen there. And by the way, if your name is there right now, if your name is going to be there, are you recognizable? Yes. It fits, doesn't it? Your name is recognizable now, and your name will be recognizable then. Yours. You. Let's take a look. Let's see.

While there are some things that are no longer, that's passively looked at, what is not stated in these passages is that we will have our memories or individual identities erased. It doesn't say you won't remember a thing. How did I get here? Who am I? Right? That's not how it happens. It's instead All these indications, including your name, is in the Lamb's Book of Life. And when you go there, your name will still be in the Lamb's Book of Life. All these multiple indications. The apostles, will they still be the apostles? Yep. Will the tribes still be the tribes? Yep. Will Abraham and Isaac and Jacob still be Abraham and Isaac and Jacob? Yep.

Yes, you're going to recognize people there. And let's put this here. and the prior question together. There is the implication from the answers to these two questions that if parents have lost a child, that they'll recognize them. That they'll recognize them.

So that's real hopeful. That's real hopeful. And it's pretty neat. It's pretty neat. Imagine, imagine what it'd be like for a mother who had the child aborted to one day see that child again. For a parent who has lost, and other family members too, for a parent who has lost a little child. at a young age, to be able to have a hope that they would see him again and even recognize him. That's pretty important, isn't it? To have a sense of peace about those kind of things now.

And even as awful as abortion is, to look at it, was it a good thing? No, it wasn't a good thing. But what an amazing thing the Lord has done. He paid the price for it all. Questions? Thoughts? Exasperations? Yes. Okay, let's revisit that. Remember the description, let me see if I can find it quickly here. At the bottom of page 4, I have the passage Revelation 21, 10-14.

It says there, and he carried me away in the Spirit to a great and high mountain, and by the way, being in the Spirit in John's context, and the original Greek John uses that phrase more than once, actually does not have the definite article. It's in Spirit. He carried me away in Spirit to a great and high mountain and showed me the holy city Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, having the glory of God. What's the glory of God? The radiant essence of who God is. It's bright. It has a brightness that is because of God's very character. Her brilliance was like a very costly stone, as a stone of crystal clear jasper.

It had a great and high wall with twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names were written on them, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel. Now listen to this description and look at that picture on the next page. Verse 13, there were three gates on the east and three gates on the north and three gates on the south and three gates on the west and the wall of the city had twelve foundation stones and on them were the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. The description of the tribes of Israel there in verses 12 and 13 matches the description of how the tribes were laid out in that diagram that you see on the top of page 5. How the tribes were laid out in their time in the desert before they even entered the promised land. when they would arrange themselves by three tribes, three tribes, three tribes, three tribes on each of the four sides around the tabernacle. The tabernacle was kind of the centerpiece with three tribes on each of the four sides, just like you will have three tribes on each of the four sides of the New Jerusalem. Does that connect? If you look at this diagram, which shows how the Israelites encamped themselves out in the desert.

If any Gentile wanted to get access to the tabernacle, because God basically dwelt in that tabernacle, right? If a Gentile wanted to get access to the tabernacle, who would they have to go through? Israel, right? And guess what? In the New Jerusalem, if the Gentiles, the nations, the ethnos, if they want to get access to the New Jerusalem, where God is and the Lamb is, guess who they have to go through? Israel.

But it's the nations, it's the ethnos, not us, the church. Yeah, not us. It's the nations, the ethnos. And by the way, this is something that Hal and I talked about specifically. I remember going through this with him. I know a few Jews, not very many, but I've asked if they know what tribe they're in. No, they have not a clue what tribe they're in now. Well, they must know then.

What's interesting is they will know then the first indication that they have a new insight into what tribe they're in because they haven't known since 70 AD when the various genealogical records were destroyed in the temple. The genealogical records were kept on the north side of the inner temple building at about the middle of that inner temple building. That's where the records were kept. 70 A.D. they were destroyed, so the Jews lost track of who was who.

It may have been for a while, and we may have some evidence. Have you heard of Jewish people, or maybe you've even known some, who have the last name Cohen? That means priest. Levitt, Levi, any of those names may possibly be indications of their tribal identity. Not certain, but possibly.

But when you look at, I think the first evidence we have of a definite recognition is Revelation chapter 7, where each tribe is named specifically. So there you have a tribal identity. These are the 144,000 single Jewish males who will have a particular and specific ministry that they're preserved for during the tribulation period. That's the first evidence that since 70 AD that they will have a certainty. And it won't obviously be from the records, those are destroyed. So the implication, it's not stated, the implication is that the Lord knows which tribe they're in, and he at that time reveals it.

That also will have to be the case in the Millennial Kingdom when they have the Millennial Temple. And you'll need to know who's of the tribe of Levi. So you're correct. Right now they don't know. Some of them may have a clue based on their last name, but that's not abundantly clear. But they will know. And I think it will be by direct revelation because the genealogical records are gone. Destroyed.

Other questions? Thoughts? I hear this buzzing in my ears. I hope that's not tinnitus. Let's pray, okay? Lord, we thank you for these assurances that we have from your word, assurances regarding those who die at whatever age, even unborn, before having an opportunity to believe. We thank you for that comfort that it offers and even a hope that that child, that in some cases we never got to hold, that we can one day spend eternity with. And Lord, we also pray we look at these identities here. We also pray and just ask that you would settle our hearts on these things, that there will be a future identity with what's happening now, but all for good. and none for regret and pain and sorrow. And so Lord, we thank you for that. Thank you for the blessing and the hope that we do have as believers. Thank you in Jesus' name. Amen.